Create-a-set "Creative" Thread

[im_biggy]

Well well, we're crowding up the board nicely...

This is the creative team! what we do is basically two things...

1. Rewrite loopholes in the storyline
2. Come up with names for creatures, tribes, and cards in R&D
3. Point and whine at everything that doesn't make any flavor sense.

The next person to post here gets to be the Head of the Creative team.

Now, On to the story...

SET NAME: ATLANTICA (???)


Focused themes
Natural Science VS Technology
Tribal set, focusing on the revival of MERFOLK

Chronology

- Creatures live in peace. Elves and other creatures live in western forests, Dwarves live in the Northern Mountains, Goblins and Ogres live close by in small villages. Merfolk Live in the underwater Eastern seas while Humans live at the center, acting as the mediator of all these creatures and as the guardians of the temple of the “Orb of Deviance,” the source of the plane’s power which have been buried for so long, its inhabitants began to revere it as a god.

- A Planeswalker arrives with his people, seeking refuge from planar destruction. As the story goes, their home plane was destroyed, and they are the only survivors. Humans welcome them into the city with open arms.

- The Refugees began introducing technology. The dwarves were particularly interested, since they already had a knack for smithy. Elves were offended by these technology, but is nonetheless interested in its benefits. Goblins and Ogres were employed by the refugees as workers and laborers, and although the income is small, the spending choices are numerous… Alcohol at pubs and the women at the brothels among them. Everyone flocked to the city, as it expands to accommodate the increasing masses. The temple ruins holding the orb was then buried beneath the gigantic city and all is left of it is its godly name.

- Soon enough, the Refugees’ motives have become apparent. Forests were cut, Mountains Mined, Waters polluted, In fact, the refugees, now known as “Taskmasters,” were responsible for their own plane’s destruction. They began working goblins like slaves, threatening them with their ogre kin, and began their campaign against humans, who wanted things back the way they were.

- They then became acquainted with the idea of a mystical orb of power, held in the temple ruins deep underneath the metropolis. With some propaganda, they successfully drive the humans, guardian and all, out of the city to become nomads and pirates. The orb was left unguarded, and was eventually discovered by the Taskmasters.

- With the orb as their new power source, live began to drain from the planes. Deserts begin to eat away at the once luscious lands, and a drought ensues.

- The orb’s Divine status was its downfall. When it fell into the hands of the invaders, people deemed that it was an act of destiny rather than an act of blasphemy. Even worse, without their human mediator, Elves and Dwarves became antagonistic and refuse to help each other to overthrow the Taskmaster’s empire. Surely they could not compete with the power of a god, so they sealed themselves off in the deepest, untouched part of their lands, simply waiting for the inevitable. Others of their kind, who have become thoroughly domesticated, even refuse to leave the metropolis. However, the most affected kind were the merfolk. Not only is the Ocean running dry, the pollution is destroying the wild life too.

- Then the Ancient Shrine of Atlantica was discovered by some merfolk explores. Inside are ancient schematics to artifacts of old, the truth about the orb of deviance and the way to restore it. They were eager to use the discoveries to topple the Taskmasters. However, they lack the ability to construct these mechanisms.

- So they need to first get the help of pirates. Ask them to go on a quest to save this plane by doing these tasks:
o Find the nomadic humans
o Find the Elves
o Find the Dwarves
o Incite the goblins to rebel
o Harness Squirrelly Wrath
o Unite them Under one banner to overthrow the taskmasters

- After a massive fight Involving them all, they restored the orb. The taskmasters got away to another plane and peace is restored.


Color wheel
White: - Ultimate Splash color. Lots of support cards.
Blue: - Merfolk Tribal. Abuses BIG LEGENDARY artifacts.
Black: - Not very spashable. Abuse TOKEN artifacts and CREATURE artifacts.
Red: - Dwarf and Goblin Tribal. Abuse EQUIPMENT artifacts.
Green: - Elf and Squirrel tribal. Artifact destruction.


Native Creature set

White
Nomads – Basic WW creature.
Guardians – Most have “Standback,” High defense and low attack.
Clerics – basic healers

Blue
Merfolk – Useless on their own, but extremely broken support cards.
Pirates – very similar to Rishadan Pirates, where your opponent can only cancel its effect with some mana or by giving you cards.

Black
Clerics – basic Life takers
Wraiths – Ghosts. Prolly shades.

Red
Dwarves – Gets boosts when equipped.
Goblins – Basic Weenie w/ haste
Ogres – big creatures of the set.

Green
Elves – Basic weenie w/ mana abilities.
Squirrels – Token generators.


Invading Creature set

White
Soldiers - Basic WW.
Humans - Utility creatures


Blue
Humans - Utility creatures
Artificers - Artifact abuse


Black
Zombies – Token Generated. Think Frankenstien.


Red
Giants - Token Generated. Think the Hulk.


Green
Beast - Token Generated. Think B-Movies.


Names

W: Kazian (Clerics and Nomads) and Guardians (Guardians)
U: Ankera/Mytar (Pirates) and Ankera (Merfolk/whatever)
B: Hymotan (Wraiths) and Brutu (Clerics)
R: Goblins (Goblins), Ruta (Dwarves) and Jugba (Ogres)
G: Farian and Vidan (Elves) and Furra (Squirrels)


Locations

W-Kaza Plains, Kazian Castle
U-Ankera Reef, Myta Island
B-Hymota Swamp, Brutu Stronghold
R-Ruta Mountains (Dwarven home)
G-Fara Forest, Vid Forest

[avatara]

The next person to post here gets to be the Head of the Creative team.


ok i suppose ill be the head of creative team

[Welding_Jar]

Okay, that's not exactly a fair system, but as far as I'm concerned, avatara would be a good head of Creative. Anyone else want to work here?

EDIT for no doublepost:

This is Creative's first assignment-we need a real name for the following card:

Anyone Could Be A Pirate 1U
Instant
The next time a Pirate would come into play under your control, each of your opponents sacrifices a permanent unless he or she pays 1.

[avatara]

vaskar for the plane name?

and i was thinking that maybe the way that the orb could be retreaved is when the goblins were lead into battle against the ogres and planes walkers by there rebelous leader.

Tik-Tok,Goblin Rebel 2RR
Legendary creature-Goblin
Goblins you control have protection from red and black.
"How ironic that the only creature with the power to stop the planeswalkers was the only one to stupid not to know it."
3/2

[Welding_Jar]

Please post card ideas, no matter how storyline related, in the R&D thread.

[im_biggy]

as for as i'm concerned, "Rebel" should not be associated with goblins. Rebels are a very set creature type in the Mercedian block so although the name has the right feel, should make it something along the lines of... "Anarchist."

Vaskar sounds right for a plane name, but it somehow feels out of touch of all the things that are going on... Sounds like "Vast Maskara" and doesn't conjure up the right feel, i guess. :p

Keelhaul 1U
Instant
The next time a Pirate would come into play under your control, each of your opponents sacrifices a permanent unless he or she pays 1.

I think Coastal Piracy should see a space here in the set
oh, and we SOOOOO need a bounce card named 'walk the plank...'

[Pietdracula]

I'm in and will design some cruel pirates, zombies and even pirate zombies

[im_biggy]

Pirates shouldn't be TOO cruel. They are working for the money and they work for the good guys. At least there should be one of them with a gerrard-like chivalry...

And as for pirate zombies....

Yes... Yes, we can shove it in the story somehow!

[dragon_flip24]

Let me in, let me in :P Although I will be putting in more work in the R&D thread.

[avatara]

in my opoinion i think pirates should be more worried about finding scraps of artifacts i.e cogs.i mean blue are artificers and once these ones were exhiled they'll need all the artifacts they can get.

[Flash]

Native Creature set

White
Nomads – Basic WW creature.
Guardians – Most have “Standback,” High defense and low attack.
Clerics – basic healers

Blue
Merfolk – Useless on their own, but extremely broken support cards.
Pirates – very similar to Rishadan Pirates, where your opponent can only cancel its effect with some mana or by giving you cards.

Black
Clerics – basic Life takers
Wraiths – Ghosts. Prolly shades.

Red
Dwarves – Gets boosts when equipped.
Goblins – Basic Weenie w/ haste
Ogres – big creatures of the set.

Green
Elves – Basic weenie w/ mana abilities.
Squirrels – Token generators.


Invading Creature set

White
Soldiers - Basic WW.
Humans - Utility creatures


Blue
Humans - Utility creatures
Artificers - Artifact abuse


Black
Zombies – Token Generated. Think Frankenstien.


Red
Giants - Token Generated. Think the Hulk.


Green
Beast - Token Generated. Think B-Movies.

If we're gonne make a block, we need 3 sets (and I'm for that) with The Beginning (basic, vanilla, NO ARTIFACTS, legendary creatures) the Invasion (attack and defense forces, small support artifacts, artifact creatures) and The End (lots of legendary, lots of tribal, allmost no support)
I guess


o Harness Squirrelly Wrath
oh ffs QUIT THE SQUIRRELS!!!! :D

[Pseudofate]

Reprint Ghost Ship. :D

Lets not talk about the next set yet. Keep it in the back of our minds, but focus on what's in front of us.

[chicken_sandwich]

Im not really clear on the invading army, in the storyline their called taskmasters, but what race are they? Are their a bunch of races that are taskmasters? Are they limited only to one color? I saw that the invading force has blue artificers, are they supposed the "top dogs" of the invaders because of their advanced technology? I would think pick a color or two for the invaders and leave it at that. If its blue then its going to be really overloaded, merfolk, prirates, and artificers. I think the invaders should be put mostly in black(just my opinion), blue could be secondary, and given a seperate or new creature type like taskmaster. As far a flavor and creature types go you definately got the native stuff down, I just think the invaders need to be expanded on both in flavor and creature types. Where do these token generated zombies, giants and beasts come from that the invaders have? Are they created form the "taskmasters" advanced technology? If the artificers made them then how would that be reflected flavorwise? Don't get me wrong, I think you guys are doing an awesome job, I just thinkthe invaders need to be clarified, maybe changed, a little more.

[Flash]

I never though having Merfolk AND Pirates was flavorfull.

Anyway, we could easilly make the Artificers black, together with all the invaders, as we have no black part on the Plane. Or at least they don't take any part in the story.

[im_biggy]

No worries, sammich.

I was planning "taskmaster" as a new creature type, using black as its main base, and yes, blue and white was supposed to be the support color.

Taskmasters will abuse token generating artifacts. Beast and Zombies (but on reflection, probably not giants) are all the results of machines that were created by the artificers, but used by the Taskmasters.

I think i might remove soldiers too. making them black is also another option.

Just that it was a lot of work to come up with a fusion story in like three hours. happy plot hole hunting!

[dragon_flip24]

What's up? This thread is dead. We can't have a one-man or two-man Creative Team! We need jobs, for Urza's sake!

[Eye of Shizo]

hmm, id rather go for Mishra, but that's just my one taste.

No serious, DF is right. We need to distribute the jobs between the personel and get along with the serious R&D'ing

Now just anybody can come up with cards, we need a more sophisticated way to get the cards we want into the Tabletting and Drawing departement

[im_biggy]

I think the current idea of 'post your card ideas' work well. as long as I regularly post a 'approval pending' post for welding to give the thumbs up on.

What we DO need to do for this thread however are two things: - Reprints and Gaps. What i mean by gaps are the missing cards that this set actually needs.

to list what we don't have: -

Ogres, Merfolk and elves. there have been some, but not a lot of these creatures.
Strong Tribal Cards. The only one i've seen so far is inundate.
Giant creature. Besides the Stompy formerly known as an elemental, we don't have a big creature for the other colors yet.
a good counterspell.
vanillas.
Chocola... i mean... legendary elf, merfolk and guardian.
anything else i've missed...
Reprints are obvious.

[FruitlessRoar]

Important Post Part I:

Okay. I'm disappointed I haven't known about this and been involved from earlier on, but so be it.
I'm a flavor hound. If a plot, a mechanic, a card, a theme has no flavor, isn't original, or doesn't make sense, I sink it.

Now something needs to be said about this set that we're making (Atlantica, no?). It needs to have an original idea. It needs to have a basic, central concept that we base all other things around. Think card types; Mirrodin had artifacts, and Onslaught had creature types. Champions has spiritcraft and legends.

This central idea needs to be based around some aspect of the story. In mirrodin, we were set on a world made of metal. That was the backstory. In Atlantica, so far I don't know what that central idea is.


Important Post Part II:

From what I've been piecing together, this world is a world of water. Do not deceive yourselves; this does not have to be a blue world. Pirates and zombies both thrive in water. Green has snakes, and all the underwater plant life. Red has the sky (elementals and dragons) and the creatures that live on the islands (perhaps goblins or dwarves). White is perfect for town settings created by ports.

So: the setting is water. I think. I mean, come on, Atlantica? This has got to be water. So now, mechanically, what is the central theme?
One thing we need to be careful of is copying off of Masques block. So effects that might not work and "purchaseable" effects don't really fly, though we can give a nod to Prophecy with a few purchaseable pirates and such.

nevertheless, that cannot be the central mechanical theme. so what is?

[im_biggy]

Welcom FR, plz sign up at the 'create-a-set' board, couple of threads down. ;)

I know naming it "atlantica" might be strange, but the central theme here are two things, if you've been following from the beginning.

Firstly, Atlantica is actually dealing with the revival of merfolk and pirates as tribal creatures. that's pretty much it. The Taskmaster came, saw and conquered, driving all other creatures apart. Merfolk will be the heroes. pirates will be the emmisaries. this set will be pretty heavy tribal in the first expansion.

Second theme is Science VS. Magic. It deals with the introduction of science (aka artifacts) from the task masters. This is by no means an artifact heavy set, but most of them can be pretty powerful, mostly token generators and equipment.

[im_biggy]

Forgot to mention... we also need cards that represent depression, pollution, drought etc.

[dragon_flip24]

We're going to have to start writing flavor text too...

[Flash]

Flavor texts are done when all cards have been done. Same with art, correct wording and balancing.

[dragon_flip24]

That may be so but we can already have a head start with the cards that are already approved and named (i.e. Keelhaul).

[im_biggy]

I think Ogres present an obvious flavouring problem. sure, they're big red creatures, but what about it?

Before the on set of Kamikawa, where ogres are primarily black, There are only 14 ogres. just by observation, they all have some similiarities, which is note worthy.

Their Power is always equal or higher than thier toughness. That's an obvious fact.

They grenerally grow in power at the cost of a resource. Frenetic Ogre and Reckless Ogre are good examples.

Do not confuse with Giants. Giants have bigger toughness, and has been associated with 'Flinging' Creatures. They are also associated with White rather than black.

From this conclusion, Ogres are absolute beatsticks with little to offer in terms of support. Probably a 3RR for a 4/3 w/haste, or something a little 'keldon champion'-esque.

[dragon_flip24]

What if sometime in the next set, some of the Dwarves learned to "tame" some Ogres, to use in their army? What is the backstory of the Ogres? Why do they fight? What is their libido in this war?

Questions to be answered. :P

[im_biggy]

Ogres are the Kins of goblins, and they are the back bone of the traditional Goblin Tribe. Without Ogres, Goblins don't have people to do thier Heavy work, and Ogres, as their powerful selves, enjoy the challenges the goblins bring.


Goblins and Ogres were recruited by the Taskmasters: Goblins as factory workers, Ogres as Bodyguards, Bouncers and Pugilists for entertainment. In the beginning all is well, but then Goblins were refused pay and turned into slaves, the Ogres, Easily manipulated, lost sight of thier kinship with the goblins and do not help them.

That is why one of the Merfolk's Goal is to incite revolution. They need to rekindle the friendship between ogres and goblins, then use thier combined powers to topple the empire... Taskmasters... whatever...

wow... plot holes galore...

[FruitlessRoar]

Welcom FR, plz sign up at the 'create-a-set' board, couple of threads down. ;)

I know naming it "atlantica" might be strange, but the central theme here are two things, if you've been following from the beginning.

Firstly, Atlantica is actually dealing with the revival of merfolk and pirates as tribal creatures. that's pretty much it. The Taskmaster came, saw and conquered, driving all other creatures apart. Merfolk will be the heroes. pirates will be the emmisaries. this set will be pretty heavy tribal in the first expansion.

Second theme is Science VS. Magic. It deals with the introduction of science (aka artifacts) from the task masters. This is by no means an artifact heavy set, but most of them can be pretty powerful, mostly token generators and equipment.

Okay, I understand that Atlantica is around water, and based around merfolk and pirates. but how does that lend itself to flavorful mechanics?

furthermore, the clash between science and magic WAS mirrodin block. from the beginning of the initial thread i could see there would be problems with this down the road. this set cannot be a repeat of mirrodin.

p.s. how do i "sign up"

[dawnbringerSO]

just say u want to. And i agree with it being around water, which is why i created those creatures in respect to that.

[dragon_flip24]

furthermore, the clash between science and magic WAS mirrodin block. from the beginning of the initial thread i could see there would be problems with this down the road. this set cannot be a repeat of mirrodin.


No, Mirrodin's storyline was nowhere near a clash between science and magic - artifacts and sorcery were actually in tune. It was a clash between its guardian (Memnarch) versus the inhabitants of Mirrodin.

[chicken_sandwich]

I'm having trouble with white creature types. We got soldiers, guards, and clerics, nomads but I think of ALL of those as subtypes, they can't be the only type on a creature. Well they do in older cards, but I was under the impression WOC was trying to phase that out (look at the new cards, they only appear as subtypes). I can see why because they are not a type of creatuere, rather a occupation, or whatever you want to call it. A creature thats a cleric or a nomad or whatever is still some type of creature, is it a bird soldier, human soldier, cat soldier, fox soldier, etc... If ya'll really want to keep nomad and cleric as creature types on their own I can live with that, or you could make them all humans, but that would mean ALOT of humans. I really think we need another creature type besides humans to fill in the gaps in white. Not much would have to change; they can still have subtype cleric and nomad. It could be birds...because right now we're at a lack of white flyers. Or we could create a small backstory for another type (like an animal tribe), say wolves, elephants, foxes, or whatever. Just my thoughts, what do ya'll think?

[FruitlessRoar]

No, Mirrodin's storyline was nowhere near a clash between science and magic - artifacts and sorcery were actually in tune. It was a clash between its guardian (Memnarch) versus the inhabitants of Mirrodin.


Okay. I think i get it now; this is science v. magic, not science v. nature. see, as i understood it, it was science v. nature, because that's something you can do with magic cards. you can't do science v. magic on magic cards. you can't pit magic against something else on magic cards. the game is called magic. everything, presumably, has some magic in it. magic is not "against" science, or at least not in THE GAME OF MAGIC.

as for the creature type problem, I think we ought to think up some of our own, or bring back some old goodies. forget goblins for a minute. try:
lizards
bears
cats
crocodiles
drakes
dryads
faeries
gnomes
gorgons
hounds
imps
wolves
trolls

[DJtwon]

Dude. Lizardmen are badass.

[im_biggy]

We've had a discussion on creature types. We set up a poll. It came to the end where nothing was glaringly popular, so the Overall story was created composing of all the important elements from each other's Ideas, Hence THIS. We wanted tribal with a splash of older creatures, highlighting the lesser used Nomads, Merfolk, Wraiths, Ogres and Squirrels... while keeping some of the fundamentals. Blue of course gets an unconventional mix of Pirates and Merfolk...

How can Magic VS. Science, as supposed to Science VS. Nature work? Simple: - All artifacts, or NO artifacts. As soon as you put some non-Equipment artifacts into play, it rips your colors dry. You play 'Pollution' themed cards, and yes you produce phenomenal mana, but at the cost of color. I think this could be saved for the expansion set... but things like...

Urban Dwarf :2::r:
Creature - Dwarf
You may Pay :5: instead of Urban Dwarf's mana cost.
3/2

Can begin appearing...

[FruitlessRoar]

I simply don't see this as being recognizably different from mirrodin. it's still about artifacts. what if - and this is big - what if we completely forgot artifacts for a block? do you know how much flavor we could cram?

[dragon_flip24]

I believe that all was said and done about the story and the flavor of this set long ago - meaning, it would be difficult to change it without redoing most of the work R&D had done.

[FruitlessRoar]

I believe that all was said and done about the story and the flavor of this set long ago - meaning, it would be difficult to change it without redoing most of the work R&D had done.

I hate to put it this way, but there IS a reason the WotC design team gets things first. you have to figure out what the set will be about before you make the cards. otherwise you're fitting the story and flavor around already-made cards with potentially bad flavor.

[dawnbringerSO]

I've created a black lizard.

But i've come up with a creature type for white. Or, it could be a tribe name.

It's called.... Melufa

Melufa are...I'll explain when i have time.

And I agree with Fruitless Roar, I've always thought upon those lines.

[im_biggy]

Folks, We don't need any new creature types, nor do we need lizards, it's not in the story... Fruitless, we've done the whole process with the story... Scroll dow 3-5 pages to look for the Polls. It's a fusion story of about 10 different ideas, so there's bound to be plot loop holes, BUT we don't really need to shuffle it up too much.

If you're complaining that some cards (that's been given the thumbs up by Welding Jar, of course) do not fit the story flavor-wise then bring it here, that's what this thread is for. R&D is where people throw in whatever ideas people have, so if you don't like some of the cards, then Burn, or preferably, Tweak it. That's how it works. Grab all the cards in one big post then Say that you hate it or like it one by one.

[dragon_flip24]

Folks, We don't need any new creature types, nor do we need lizards, it's not in the story... Fruitless, we've done the whole process with the story... Scroll dow 3-5 pages to look for the Polls. It's a fusion story of about 10 different ideas, so there's bound to be plot loop holes, BUT we don't really need to shuffle it up too much.

If you're complaining that some cards (that's been given the thumbs up by Welding Jar, of course) do not fit the story flavor-wise then bring it here, that's what this thread is for. R&D is where people throw in whatever ideas people have, so if you don't like some of the cards, then Burn, or preferably, Tweak it. That's how it works. Grab all the cards in one big post then Say that you hate it or like it one by one.

I was going to say something like that but didn't have enough authority to. Plus, I was going to say that all FR has been doing is complain in both threads, which makes him sort of a wart.

[FruitlessRoar]

first, dragonflip, you just disagree with me. I've given constructive criticism and suggestions for changing the process. that's starkly different from complaining - though I do reserve the right to complain if and when a bad decision is made at the top end of this.

Folks, We don't need any new creature types, nor do we need lizards, it's not in the story... Fruitless, we've done the whole process with the story... Scroll dow 3-5 pages to look for the Polls. It's a fusion story of about 10 different ideas, so there's bound to be plot loop holes, BUT we don't really need to shuffle it up too much.

If you're complaining that some cards (that's been given the thumbs up by Welding Jar, of course) do not fit the story flavor-wise then bring it here, that's what this thread is for. R&D is where people throw in whatever ideas people have, so if you don't like some of the cards, then Burn, or preferably, Tweak it. That's how it works. Grab all the cards in one big post then Say that you hate it or like it one by one.

Tonight, then. I do not have time this morning to do something that comprehensive, but tonight I will do just that.

[dragon_flip24]

Yeah, maybe I do. You go on, I'd like to see your side. Hopefully, it will be some help to us.

[Aggro]

I was hoping to join up. I posted some suggestions in the other thread for this without posting here first, my bad. As far as me joining up, it seems like you have enough people. If I could contribute in someway, just let me know. Flavor text, the cleaning up of mechanics, whatever somebody else isn't already covering.

[FruitlessRoar]

Http://forum.tcgplayer.com/showthread.php?t=8537
"The Set"
Good: An excellent way to keep records of the cards we have
Bad: It gives everything a set-in-stone feel, which is almost definitely a bad thing. You automatically assume everything that made it in is good.
Http://forum.tcgplayer.com/showthread.php?t=8452
Good: a great reference for us to use to figure out about how much of a card type to put in the set
Bad: might confuse people with outliers. We're not going to have as many artifacts as mirrodin, or as many creatures as legions. We probably shouldn't have any artifact creatures at all.
Http://forum.tcgplayer.com/showthread.php?t=8337
Good: an interesting way to come up with a story
Bad: kind of without nuance. It's either yours or its someone else's. No team effort. No chance for a better plot out of mutuality. Also, not enough people voted to make it useful.
Http://forum.tcgplayer.com/showthread.php?t=8175
Pretty much same comments as the last one
Http://forum.tcgplayer.com/showthread.php?t=7897
Good: um...
Bad: I think this thread was pretty destructive. This pretty much drove everyone in the same direction as mirrodin. Industry can't be easily represented without artifacts, and for those who presented it as nature v. Science, that's pretty much mirrodin right there.


I'll comment on the main thread in great depth later, just wanted to get these out of the way.
edit: i'm going to split up the post into stuff that should go into R&D and stuff that should be here for flavor.