Unanswered Echo

[Chainer9999]

Unanswered Echo :2::b: :b:
Sorcery

Each player sacrifices all creatures he or she controls. For each creature sacrificed this way, that creature's controller may search his or her library for a card with the same name as that creature and put it into play. Each player that did so shuffles his or her library.

"I called, but where there used to be a response, there is now but a shell of a voice."

[Litlfatdog]

hey very cool idea. many thumbs up. ive got no problems with it other than it's a card that does nothing by itself.

[jaros]

Great idea, however I don't see wether it should be black or not. Perhaps the card could cost less, considering that all your creatures suffer summoning sickness once more.

[Chainer9999]

Well, when I made this card, I was thinking along the lines of CIP effects(Eternal Witness, Nekrataal, and the like), but I really can't figure out whether this card should be black. I'll think about making it :1: :b: :b: .

[Litlfatdog]

i think it should definitely be black. and since the ability is so unique it's pretty hard to cost. i'd just leave it as is unless someone comes up with something convincing.

[Impaler[WrG]]

The effect is cool but when actualy played all these "copies" that come into play are not going to be the physical cards that you saced, the cards will all be in the Graveyard and you will be using a bunch of tokens with no text witch will be a giant pain in the ***. If on the other hand you DO try to just keep everything ware it is then your graveyard is short a bunch of creatures.

I think the solution is to change the text to

"All creatures you control come into play (they do not leave play)"

Its nice and simple and gets right to the point of activating all thouse comes into play effects. The cards never actualy leave play (so no leaves play effects). They all just come into play again as an isolated event, as illogical as it may sound at first Magic dose not require that things make sense only that they follow the rules (witch are ofcorse subject to change at any time).

[Chainer9999]

True, but that doesn't put the cards in your graveyard, which is another part of this card's effect(and perhaps the part that can be used to maximize its effect). I'll consider your opinion, but if someone else can give me a wording that lets me keep my original card and clear up the rules confusion, I'd really appreciate it.

[keldon]

Unanswered Echo :2::b: :b:
Sorcery
Sacrifice all nontoken creatures,then return them to play under their owner’s control.

This one works.... However such effects are usually white (and RFG instead of saccing)...

[Impaler[WrG]]

Theirs no way we can have thouse cards both in your Graveyard AND in play at the same time. Copies of a card are theoreticaly not token creatures so it would seem they could exist in a graveyard (someone correct me if thats wrong, its just a guess realy). But the confusion generated by trying to mentaly keep track of all these copies in play or in a graveyard is going to be way too taxing in my opinion.

For pure headach prevention I would drop the nessesity to put cards in the Graveyard and focus on the Comes into play effects witch are in the end the main point.

[dawnbringerSO]

if u put a copy of something into play it has all the texts the origional did...

[Impaler[WrG]]

Yes but with only 1 PHYSICAL card with text on it and a bunch of face down place holders you will have all kinds of dificulty destinquishing one from another.

[Chainer9999]

']Yes but with only 1 PHYSICAL card with text on it and a bunch of face down place holders you will have all kinds of dificulty destinquishing one from another.

Can you clear up what you're trying to say? I don't quite get you.

[gl490]

about the name, since the creature come back, how is the echo unanswered, and also, i think this could cost BB

[Hajime Saito]

Can you clear up what you're trying to say? I don't quite get you.

He is trying to convey that no real cards will be in play after this hits. Meaning if you have lets say 2 witness 1 Troll Ascetic and a rootrunner you would have to use various forms of tokens for cards that do have have explicit tokens(like soldiers and goblins and the like) Meaning it might get confusing keeping track of whats what.

Awsome card by the way I dig the name. I think it'd be cool if you added 'They are now Spirits in addition to other creature types.' To reflect their leaving this realm.

Just a thought

[jaros]

For each creature sacrificed this way, put a copy of it into play under your control.
Under current rules, it would be worded like this:
For each creature, sacrificed this way, put a creature token into play that's a copy of that creature.

[Chainer9999]

Hmm...good one jaros. I'll edit my post.

[keldon]

Hmm...good one jaros. I'll edit my post.

Just i don't understand why you do not want my version written above... it will remove all confusion and just put creatures in graveyard and back without using tokens...

[Impaler[WrG]]

He wants the real cards in his graveyard and token copies in play, this way black gets its graveyard filled and can potentialy raise them from the dead. With enough raising of the dead you could esentialy Duplicated every creature you controled at the time you played this spell.

[Chainer9999]

']He wants the real cards in his graveyard and token copies in play, this way black gets its graveyard filled and can potentialy raise them from the dead. With enough raising of the dead you could esentialy Duplicated every creature you controled at the time you played this spell.

My point exactly.

[keldon]

The main concern with this card is that you would find yourself with a bunch of tokens, all of which have different abilities and no reminder of what they are... unless you have the right tokens for all creatures...

[Chainer9999]

Hmmm...was there ever a card in Magic that allowed you to copy a creature? Kinda like Sculpting Steel?

[Litlfatdog]

i love the card but keldon is right, this card would be soo annoying to play with because of all the random tokens. sculpting steel is not a good argument because it only copies one creature and uses itself as the copy.. i mean there's not much you can do to fix the token problem its just wizards would never print something like this because of that problem

[Wry]

Just Flicker all creautres you control? It's functionally the same thing.

[Chainer9999]

Just Flicker all creautres you control? It's functionally the same thing.

Read Impalers reply a few posts up.

[Wry]

Eureka!......

"For each creature you control, search your library for a card with the same name as that creature and put it into your graveyard. Then shuffle your library. "

[Litlfatdog]

Eureka!......

"For each creature you control, search your library for a card with the same name as that creature and put it into your graveyard. Then shuffle your library. "

almost, but doesn't trigger leaves-play effects- i would say:

"Sacrifice all creatures you control. For each creature sacrificed this way, you may search your library for a card with the same name as that creature and put it into play. Then shuffle your library."

[Chainer9999]

Hmmm...while that doesn't exactly have the brokenness of my original version(free tokens!), that may be functionally what I'm after. I'll think about it.

Also, what do you guys think about the mana cost? Is it too expensive for a situational card, or is it right?

[Impaler[WrG]]

I like that new wording Dog it avoids all that token confusion.

I think the Cost might actualy need to be upped a bit, their are LOTS of comes into play effects for Black and your filling your graveyard up with probably on average 3 bodies that you can quickly reanimate. Admitedly your not realy tutoring for anything here as you only get what you already had in play to begin with, thats the only real downside. What do the rest of you think?

[YugDung]

I really really really like the new wording.

It has some inherent drawbacks, (I only have 2 copies in my deck, and the other is in my hand), (anti-deck thinning, as you now have many more lands than creatures... unless of course you are looking for an instant or a sorcery...), and is really cool. I would drop the cost to 1BB...

Another cool idea, which would make this much much much more black... would be to make it affect both players. My only concern with that is limited... it's pretty much a wrath of god in most situations that way. If you make it affect both players, definitely make it 2BB, if not 3BB. (Please consider it... it's sooo much cooler that way)

[Chainer9999]

Hmm....interesting suggestion, Yug. Now that I think of it, it does seem more black that way...It's a new black Wrath of God! Suggestion accepted!:D

[Aricanius]

This plus Kukusho.

I like the card. It's insanely powerful, but I like it.

[Provoke]

NON-TOKEN!!!

other then that, it looks fine to me.